Toyota Wheel Decoding (Split from MS II v2.33 thread)

[torn81]

Do you think your code, or anybody's code, would work for a toyota with a 24 tooth wheel and a 2 tooth wheel dizzy? It would be nice for the late 80s and early 90s toyotas out there.
Thnak you
Darrow

I want to megasquirt my toyota celica with a 3sgte using the stock distributor also (with all stock factory sensors if possible). Also I think alot of other toyota/mazda is using this kind of distributor, so this type of code would benefit a lot of people in the community.

From what I read there's two possibilities with those distributor (the trigger wheel is on the camshaft behind the distributor):

1st possibility: It uses 2 wheels, with 3 VR sensor (1 sensor on the 24 tooth wheel, 2 sensors at opposite direction reading one tooth on second wheel)

2nd possiblity : It uses 2 wheels, with 2 VR sensor (1 sensor on the 24 tooth wheel, 1 sensor on the second wheel with two tooth)

Will it be possible to configure this kind of setup on 2.5 code ? I was planning on using MS2, but MSnS-E seems to be already able to decode this kind of setup, so I may have to use megasquirt 1 with MSnS-E ..

Also, I believe we need to build some type of VR conditionner to be able to get a proper signal fro the VR sensor with the V3 board ?

-Phil

[muythaibxr]

It won't work on the 2.5x code when it's released as that code is only for cars with missing teeth wheels... However, I'm planning on adding some second trigger code when that 2.5x code is released...

I think they're still working on that code though, so it might be a while before something usable is out.

[DarrowConley]

torn81,
From my understanding the MS2 V3.0 alrady comes with the option to have a VR input in to the V3.0 board. In the build instuctions it tells you how to make the board for a VR input. So the ability to not have to use the HEI units is there we Toyota guys just need to wait for a wheel decoder or start grinding some points off of the dizzy wheels.

Darrow

[ochizon]

Is the ignition system on the 3sgte similar to this?






This is the one on my tacoma, and I also am trying to figure out how to control timing....

[muythaibxr]

the 3sgte is similar but not the same...

I believe it has 2 G sensors exactly opposite of each other, and an NE sensor... all are on a distributor... the distributor doesn't have any missing teeth, just 24 Ne teeth and 1 G tooth.

it ends up looking like a 12+1 wheel to the megasquirt (in msns-extra).

If you want to use the toyota setup with the MS2 right now... you'll want to grind a couple of teeth off the Ne wheel in the distributor (opposite of each other). Just make sure you have it all lined up right when you start grinding.

[ochizon]

muyth,

I have the msns-E, but I am just unfamiliar with ignition...any clue based on this diagram what I need to do to get it running, or is that not specific enough?

EDIT: Sorry, I forgot that this was the MS-II only forum.

But anyone that would like to respond could do so here:

http://www.msefi.com/viewtopic.php?t=15172

[froej25]

I'm trying to work with a different system- the VAST used on the 22R-E. Found some good diagrams here: http://www.autoshop101.com/forms/h23.pdf. Gives some good info on the evolution of Toyota ignition systems. Or go to http://www.autoshop101.com, in the technical section, they have a bunch of Toyota-specific stuff. I think the 3SGTE uses the TCCS / ESA system, which uses the 24 tooth wheel (Ne= number of engine revolutions) for crankshaft angle detection, combined with a 1, 2, or 4 tooth wheel (G1 / G2 signal) for TDC determination. Not sure, but if you don't mind losing some resolution, you may be able to use a 4-tooth wheel from a different vehicle; either one that was originally a G sensor or one from a VAST equipped engine (may be able to use the whole distributor from the 2S-E, I think it would be the same engine family). That would save you the setup pain of chopping teeth, and the hassle of combining input signals. Although, I'm not sure if the VR output is "normal"; no one answers when I ask that question; Toyota and Nissan use coil / magnet induction instead of reluctor sensors, not sure what the output looks like.

[muythaibxr]

muyth,

I have the msns-E, but I am just unfamiliar with ignition...any clue based on this diagram what I need to do to get it running, or is that not specific enough?

EDIT: Sorry, I forgot that this was the MS-II only forum.

But anyone that would like to respond could do so here:

http://www.msefi.com/viewtopic.php?t=15172

You could probably get away with just using the Ne (crank) wheel as it looks like an 18-2 wheel if that diagram is accurate. that'd be 20 degrees of crank rotation per tooth...

Ken

[torn81]

The 3sgte 2nd gen ignition system (90 to 93 at least) is working like this:



As electronic is not my field (computer programming is), anyone can confirm if I understood correctly hows the ignition works on a 3sgte?

Here's how I see it. If I understand this diagram, there's one signal rotor that has 1 teeth, and 2 VR sensors. As the signal rotors are on the camshaft and not on the crank, both sensor will hit every 720 degrees of crankshaft's rotation, by an interval of 360 degrees each. So, the crankshaft turn 360 degrees, G1 is triggered. The crankshaft turn another 360 degrees, and G2 is triggered.

Example:
G1 triggered -> rotation of 360 degrees on crank -> G2 triggered -> rotation of 360 degrees on crank -> G1 triggered -> etc

The other signal rotor has 24 full tooth with no missing teeth, and NE is triggered at each tooth. Everytime NE is triggered, the camshaft turned 15 degrees, and the crankshaft turned 30 degrees.

Is what I say sounds like correct ?

Also, is a stock 3sgte running on sequential injection ? Or at least, has the necessary information from G1, G2 and NE signals to be able to run on sequential injection using the stock ignition system ?

Sorry for the long post ... just want to see if my thoughs are correct or not, and maybe that will help getting this type of distributor/igniter system work on the MSII.

-Phil