Coils with built in ignition drivers?

Gary · Post by **Gary** » Thu Mar 02, 2006 5:52 am

Been a bit slow for the microsquirt forum so...

I'm looking to use microsquirt for a 6 cylinder wasted spark (GM 3.4L V6 and porsche flat 6). Understand that the intended application of microsquirt (motorcycles / watercraft) trumps the need for 3 onboard ignition drivers, but wonder if there are stock applications out there with coils/ignitors in one unit.

I've been surfing msefi, ebay, summit, etc. looking for which coils have built in ignitors/drivers. Not much luck (at least with how I'm surfing). I've seen the bosch coils used on VW/audi - they're big and pretty expensive.

If need be, I can put 3 VB921's on a board in a seperate box, but that seems like a kludge... Also could go with a DIS or EDIS box, but really hoping to leverage the -9S12 speed to decrease parts count.

jsmcortina · Post by **jsmcortina** » Mon Mar 06, 2006 3:11 pm

The present plan for the Microsquirt code is TWO ignition outputs using TWO tach inputs as used on many bikes. The two channels are sequenced independently so will work in odd or even-fire configurations.

LS1 coils are "smart" logic-level coil-near-plug units.

If you extended the Microsquirt code to support a third channel, you could easily fit another ignition driver chip to the inside top of the case as there is plenty of room.

James

muythaibxr · Post by **muythaibxr** » Tue Mar 07, 2006 5:48 am

The toyota 7mgte coil/ignitor pack is used for controlling 6 cyl engines in wasted spark configuration. IF someone wrote code to support the weird inputs it takes, you could drive it with a few simple pullups to +5v with a few transistors. I'm not sure that's any easier than using vb921's though.

The signal is weird in that one signal is the advance every 120 degrees of engine rotation, and the other two signals are "coil select" signals that tell the ignitor to which coil pack the dwell/spark are supposed to be applied.

Matt Cramer · Post by **Matt Cramer** » Tue Mar 07, 2006 1:05 pm

And let's not forget that the MS-II (and, by extension, Microsquirt?) already works with the GM 3.4's stock DIS.

Gary · Post by **Gary** » Thu Mar 09, 2006 7:59 pm

Matt Cramer wrote:And let's not forget that the MS-II (and, by extension, Microsquirt?) already works with the GM 3.4's stock DIS.

With 2.53 code, would you still need the DIS ignition module?

Matt Cramer · Post by **Matt Cramer** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 5:12 am

Gary wrote:With 2.53 code, would you still need the DIS ignition module?

I'm pretty sure you would. IIRC, 2.53 simply adds a wheel decoder for a distributor-type ignition, with multiple coil support coming later - or possibly requiring a GPIO board.

Gary · Post by **Gary** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 5:44 am

Ya-but,

reading James' comments, it looks like when Microsquirt is released, it will support two coils. Not sure why there are two tach inputs (must be for odd-fire support), but will check the code and release notes when it comes out. Seems like extending the code to a third ignition output won't be a huge chore.

Gary · Post by **Gary** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 6:25 am

So it looks like some of the available logic level modules are the VW VR6 and Toyota 7mgte. Logic level COP or coil-near-plug are the LS1, late model hondas and acuras. Others? Looks like I oughta do a junk yard run and explore some coils.

jsmcortina · Post by **jsmcortina** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 7:34 am

Gary wrote:Ya-but,

reading James' comments, it looks like when Microsquirt is released, it will support two coils. Not sure why there are two tach inputs

Many bikes use dual VR sensors from the factory and a single tooth on the crank. The Microsquirt should wire right up to it.

James

sparkandfuel.com · Post by **sparkandfuel.com** » Fri Mar 10, 2006 3:11 pm

muythaibxr wrote:The toyota 7mgte coil/ignitor pack is used for controlling 6 cyl engines in wasted spark configuration. IF someone wrote code to support the weird inputs it takes, you could drive it with a few simple pullups to +5v with a few transistors. I'm not sure that's any easier than using vb921's though.

The signal is weird in that one signal is the advance every 120 degrees of engine rotation, and the other two signals are "coil select" signals that tell the ignitor to which coil pack the dwell/spark are supposed to be applied.

like the toyota multiplex in msns-e? that was written for the 7mgte, and was reported to work ok if rigged right.